White Train

[DSteyn]

I am not sure I am in the right place for the answers to the questions I have. But I have no idea where to start so am hoping you can piont me in the right direction.

I am researching a great grandfather (John James Ulrich) who was a engine driver on steam locomotives in South Africa and it is rumoured that he drove a "Royal White Train".
The problem is I do not have any dates, only that he died in 1958.
So my question is, how do I reseach his employment records and if he did infact drive a Royal White Train or not?

I hope you can adviceme on this.

[Kevin Wilson-Smith]

Thanks for your e-mail!

A challenge! I cannot help here, but I am sure that there are some others who may be able to (ahem John?? For starters?).

I will draw his attention to this post!

If you want to post on any other topics of have photos etc please do so!

[John Ashworth]

I too don't have any direct information on this, but we can ask around some of the old engine drivers that we know, eg the two Cliffs.

How about Nathan, as an old fireman? Does he know anything?

[Kevin Wilson-Smith]

Thanks John - have sent a sent an e-mail to the others.

[DSteyn]

Thanks guys for all the help you are willing to give.
I hope to have more information by the end of the week. I have also heard that there is a photo on JJ Ulrich and his Fireman next to one of the trains he drove. I hope to have a copy or at least the engine number soon. But alas thats in SA and I am stuck in a cold wet France!

Deon

[DSteyn]

Hi :(
Ok I have just found out that the "White" train actually is the BLUE train! Once again my gran had it wrong, God rest her soul.
And that John Jame ULRICH arrived in South Africa by ship when he was 21, so would have been 1901.

But my quiery still stands. How do I find out more about his employment record? What trains did he drive?

Regards,
Deon

[John Ashworth]

Today I raised this with two of our old hands, Uncle John D, who started his long career as a steam fitter in 1958, and Uncle Cliff A, who began his career as a fireman and then driver in the 1960s.

Neither of them had heard of John James Ulrich. They tell us that to drive the Blue Train he would have been a special grade driver, but he could have been based at any of several locomotive depots which served that route. If he was 21 in 1901, he would have been 78 by the time he died in 1958, so he would have been long retired from the railways and it's unlikely we will find anyone who knows of him.

If you can find out where he was based then it might be possible to find out more.

[John Ashworth]

Yesterday I spoke to our driver Cliff P, who began as a fireman in 1961. He vaguely recalls having heard the name Ulrich. He has promised to ask his dad, an 89 year old ex-driver who has now been retired for 34 years, whether he ever came across John James Ulrich in his younger days.

[DSteyn]

Hi John,
Thanks again for all the help. I hope to have more info to go on by the end of the weekend.
Deon

[Derek Walker]

The "White Train" did exist, it was used on the royal visit and to transport politicians down to CT as well as the State President when he decided to go by train. I remember seeing it when I was still an apprentice in Braamfontein, it used to live in a shed behind the EL&P training centre between the rails. The Drakensberg Express (the original Blue Train) also was there as was the much vaunted MetroBlitz. I was an appy between 1982 and 1985 in Braamfontein With SATS. Gee, I wish I had taken photographs!

[Stefan Andrzejewski]

Likewise. I remember the White train parked in the siding outside Rondebosch.(Circa 1960's to early 1980's) This siding was used by the Tanners and the Sasko Mills until the Early 1980's. When Parliment opened the White Train would park there. The circus train was also stabled their from time to time. They had quite a few lines and shunting occured sometimes twice a day when the 14CRB's did their stuff down to Simons Town. Standing on the platform, you could feel the heat of the Loco as it swished past. I wish I had photos from that time. I grew up in Mowbray close to the line. I think that's where my passion for trains originated. Last year whilst visiting the George museum I took a photo of this plan of Mowbray Station

[Tom Macrery]

Derek, What is an 'appy'? Thanks, Tom

[Mike Haslam]

You should approach Les Pivnic, a wonderful source of SAR information. Les produced a "Photo Journal" of SAR, one edition of which was a special on the "White Train". There is also lots of Blue train info there as well. John A - you have my copy!! There are some White Train coaches at the Museum in George, unless they have been removed.

Les also has contacts still in SAR. You would have to go back in their records to find out specific information.

A number of locomotives were assigned to the Blue train and their drivers were specifically chosen. You might have heard of a "Blue Train Start" - a gentle pull-away which the passengers do not notice until they see the countryside passing!

There was even a special Blue Train shunt locomotive, painted blue and stationed at Pretoria. I think it got transferred to George and the THF.

Tom, the wordsmith - you should know an "appy" - an apprentice.

Turtle

[Derek Walker]

Yep, an Appy is an apprentice. I did my apprenticeship as a telecomms electrician with SA Transport Services as it was known then and was stationed in Germiston. I often had to wade through 12 inches of soot looking for cables in the steam loco.

[John Ashworth]

Tom and I helped Robert with a particularly stubborn bit of wiring on 3117 last year. I think there was still a bit of soot lying around, even though she had been standing for 17 years! Robert is an old steam fitter and he remarked that in the old days there were electrical fitters who did this type of work. We had to make do with an old circuit diagram, a circuit tester and a lot of head-scratching.