Vossloh to supply Euro Dual locomotives to PRASA

[John Ashworth]

Vossloh to supply Euro Dual locomotives to South Africa

[Mel Turner]

Specification sheets for the diesel
http://www.vossloh-espana.com/media/dow ... ers_us.pdf
Unless PRASA require hotel strength HEP, 4300 HP is too great for a loco on Cape gauge with DC traction. NG (EMD Universal type) DC traction motors only capable of a maximum 500 HP equivalent input, so without a HEP requirement, allowing for a 10% parasitic load, only 3300 HP is required, so prime mover may be downgraded to a 12-710 @ 3300 HP

No spec sheet for the B-B duel loco issued, however refer to this photo for an indication
http://www.railcolor.net/index.php?nav= ... lm7TFOyl1E

[Mel Turner]

This photo of a Euro Duel, Photoshopped with PRASA lettering showed up on an Argentinean site

http://wordpress2.erf.com.ar/wp-content ... frica1.jpg

http://wordpress2.erf.com.ar/?p=17460

[John Ashworth]

Thanks, Mel. Very interesting. It will bring a clean modern elegance to South African railways, as most of the existing locos are pretty slab-fronted and workman-like in their appearance.

The specifications appear to be for 1435 mm gauge, but I see the graphs at the bottom are 1067 mm (or is that supposed to refer to wheel diameter?) Will these be the first of this type of loco built to Cape Gauge? I believe Argentina is metre gauge, so presumably Vossloh does have experience of building them to gauges narrower than standard gauge.

[Mel Turner]

Material y Construcciones S.A. or MACOSA was a Spanish heavy-engineering company, building EMD locomotives under license from the '60's to the '80's. From 1989 onwards the organization was named Meinfesa and became part of the GEC-Alstom group of companies. In 2005 it was purchased by the German Vossloh group as Vosloh Espana, later renamed Vossloh Rail Vehicles. Vossloh still has a close working relationship with Progress Rail/EMD, with PR recently licensing Vossloh body shells for the forthcoming EMD F125 Passenger locomotive to be built at Muncie in the US

From 1971 to 1973 Macosa built meter gauge G22U and G22CU for RFFSA in Brazil. The Alstom AD26C was built at the same works, and supplied in Cape gauge to CFM, the DRC, and Ghana. The Valencia works has a long history as an OEM bogie supplier to other builders

South Africa will be the first user of narrow gauge Euro 4000, and Euro Duel. however the NG application is really academic, as the European and South African loading gauges are so similar

[Mel Turner]

Wikipedia has a detailed page on the Euro diesel series
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vossloh_Euro_locomotives

I have a gut feeling that if PRASA do not require hotel strength HEP, then the 12 cylinder 710 prime mover from the 3000 series will be used, as EMD narrow gauge DC traction motors are limited to a bit under 500 HP. Vossloh have supplied an AC traction variant of the 3000 to Israel. Narrow gauge AC traction motors are capable of much higher horsepower, if Prasa has specified AC/AC will be interesting to see which engine is utilised

[Aidan McCarthy]

The plot thickens see article in Die Burger http://www.dieburger.com/nuus/2013-10-1 ... -keer-meer

[John Ashworth]

Thanks, Aidan. The article is in Afrikaans but Google translate mangles it as follows:

WILL BE BUILT IN SPAIN
Trains now costs twice
Research contract, asks DA

JAMES-BRENT STYAN
Sunday, October 13, 2013

CAPE TOWN. - The Passenger (Prasa) has awarded a contract for 70 new locomotives to a group that the locomotives manufactured in Spain by twice as much as it would cost locally.
Prasa awarded the contract to a consortium with name Swifambo, the new locomotives on a bruikhuurgrondslag Prasa rental.

Swifambo in turn a contract with the Spanish manufacturer Vossloh locomotives manufactured in Spain.

By Vossloh totaled the transaction € 250 million (R3, 4 billion). It is approximately R48, 5 million per locomotive.

Ian Ollis, DA MP, said the locomotives was in South Africa for R25 million by Transnet manufactured.

Transnet has not yet responded to inquiries, but it has been determined that the group in 2012 a contract of R2, 6 billion for 95 new locomotives made with China South Rail, amounting to R27 million per locomotive. Furthermore, all these Transnet locomotives, except first ten, manufactured in South Africa.

Ollis said Prasa's lokomotiefkontrak a violation of various procurement rules and regulations. "The treasury regulations for trains determined that at least 55% diesel and 60% of electric locomotives to be manufactured locally."

Ollis yesterday issued a statement in which the DA called on the Auditor-General to examine the contract.

Lucky Montana, Prasa CEO, said the group rejected the DA's statement.

He said Swifambo was one of six companies and consortiums for the contract bid. GE South Africa Technology and CRM Consortium bidding, but Montana said the Swifambo bid was the best.

He said Transnet was part of the GE consortium.

"If Transnet Rail Engineering (TRE) can do the job, why did he not tendered on its own?" Montana said.

He said there are elements in Transnet and spoorwegvakbonde pressure to place on Prasa to TRE for Prasa's projects. "But TRE does not have the ability to make Prasa's targets. Locally, we also need the kind of technology available Prasa. "

Montana added that the contract with Swifambo also allows for 40% local content.

"When it comes to contracts' local content requirements, it is important to focus on the size of the contracts. The Swifambo contract is small compared with Prasa's total program of R123 billion for new trains.

"The greater part of the contract, local production elements."

He said it does not always make sense with smaller contracts to expect manufacturers to set up factories in South Africa.

Montana has accused the DA of cheap politicking. "The DA comment on something he knows nothing."

[Mel Turner]

Ian Ollis is comparing apples with oranges. How can you compare the cost of a locomotive produced by a parastatal with one built by free enterprise? The "cost" of a locomotive produced by TE will be a figment of socialist politician's and apparatchik's imaginations

Why does Transnet Engineering exist? TE competes with, and stifles free enterprise, is not subject to the same accounting and business rules. With borrowings guaranteed by the state, it obtains finance at a cheaper rate, and is not subject to the same tax regime as free enterprise. It never paid for its works and infrastructure, this was gifted by the State at its inception, I doubt that it is paying interest on its underlying capital assets, it also has the ability to "hide" its true labour costs by shuffling staff. To meet the aspirations of the ruling political class its headcount is obscenely inflated. The State should not be meddling in a segment of the market that can be better filled by free enterprise at a much lower cost to the taxpayer

Poor old Ted Zulu has had to raise every cent of RRL Grindrod's capital, comply with the legal requirements of your country's corporate legal and tax codes, and has created a viable locomotive manufacturing base in the face of Transnet (and the Transnet unions) intransigence

[John Ashworth]

PRASA €250M CONTRACT FOR VOSSLOH LOCOS

“SOMETHING FISHY ABOUT PRASA’S R3.5BN DEAL”

[Malcolm Wilton-Jones]

Sneak preview of the first Euro 4000HP for South Africa: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... fa0891e5c1 and how they cope with 3' 6" gauge in the factory https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... 81eef86a78
I have an agreement with the factory that these photographs may not be published, please honour that agreement, they are for private viewing only.
By the way, does anyone know what class they will become yet?

[John Ashworth]

Good to hear from you again Malcolm, after what seems like a long absence.

[Mel Turner]

Is anyone able to confirm that the Euro 4000 diesels for PRASA will be AC traction?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vossloh_Euro

There is no way that 4000HP can be fed into 6 narrow gauge DC traction motors, which would suggest that either the PRASA units are AC, or alternatively that at least 1000HP will be used for HEP, with 3000+HP less the parasitic load for (DC) traction

The Euro 3000 is built as a AC/AC for Israel, so Vossloh has used AC/AC in the Euro Series (and in the US market co-designed F125), but at 23 meters this will be a long loco for South Africa

While on queries, if anyone knows the specification (engine type/make of alternator) for the new CNR diesels for Transnet, can they please contact me by PM. There are rumours from the States that these may have the same engine/alternator as the PRASA units. CNR Dallian assemble the EMD JT56ACe/HXn3 (at least 330 plus prototypes built to date), so have been working as a an EMD licensee for several years http://www.emdiesels.com/emdweb/products/jt56ace.jsp

[Malcolm Wilton-Jones]

Although Vossloh España do not appear to have published the full specification yet the following statement regarding the EuroDual implies that any variations that are available for the Euro family can be applied across the board for any model. "The EURODual from Vossloh Rail Vehicles makes the most of all the modular variations of its two platforms (EURO 4000 and EUROLIGHT) and offers operators, besides three diesel traction categories (700 kW; 1,400 kW and 2,800 kW) and an electric traction of 5,000 kW."
All the documentation from Vossloh was published before this order came through, hence there is no mention of this specific configuration. Since at least two locomotives are virtually finished (a second one is already in an advanced state of painting) it may be that one will go to Innotrans and the specifications will be released there. One of the UKLights is already on the way to Innotrans so it is quite probable that more information will be obtained by those attending that event. I will ask.

[Malcolm Wilton-Jones]

At least 3 locomotives are almost complete with 2 painted, the first one has been numbered AFRI4001, here are some pictures but please do not publish them elsewhere.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... c8bfda9f76
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... 07b7d8b321
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... 4b8db969aa
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... 02a7f0c36a